- mbed-tls - lists.trustedfirmware.org

mbedtls_base64_encode reports different olen's when used for size checking and when encoding

by Frederik Wedel-Heinen

Hi, I don't understand why mbedtls_base64_encode returns different olen's for the same source buffer. See example below: uint8_t s[10]; uint8_t d[17]; size_t sz; int ret; ret = mbedtls_base64_encode(NULL, 0, &sz, s, 10); // returns sz == 17 ret = mbedtls_base64_encode(d, 17, &sz, s, 10); // returns sz == 16 Shouldn't it be the same? Regards, Frederik

5 years, 2 months

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Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by Dan Handley

Hi Janos It's not so much that the toolchain stdlib implementations are less trusted from a security point of view, it's that there is variation in their non-functional characteristics, e.g. * security * robustness * code size * performance * open-ness * ... If you remove this variation it's easier to reason about the non-functional characteristics of the code. This is perhaps more important for projects that build final executable images but may also be important for libraries, especially ones that export executable link libraries like Mbed TLS. On the other hand, Mbed TLS is deployed in many other places than Trusted Firmware and it may be hard to choose a stdlib implementation that works for all users. Perhaps the compromise is to create a shared stdlib implementation for Trusted Firmware deployments but leave the choice open for other Mbed TLS users? Regards Dan > -----Original Message----- > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of > Janos Follath via mbed-tls > Sent: 09 April 2020 12:18 > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > Subject: Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code > base > > Hi, > > Based on what I read on this thread it seems an accepted point of view that > the toolchain provided C standard library implementations are less trusted > than the toolchains themselves. Can somebody please help me understand the > reasoning behind this distinction? > > Regards, > Janos > > On 09/04/2020, 12:07, "Dan Handley via mbed-tls" <mbed- > tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> wrote: > > Hi > > There has already been some discussion about a shared C standard library > implementation, at least for TF-A and TF-M. So far there's been general > agreement that this is a good idea but no actual commitment from anyone to > make this happen, since each project is reasonably happy with what they've > got. > > Regarding MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C, TF-A at least enables this so > removing this from the codebase would be an issue there. Memory allocators > are probably not the core expertise of other Trusted Firmware projects either > but it needs to be if they're going to use them! > > I propose that we move this allocator into a new shared > TrustedFirmware.org standard C library project and work with the other > projects to ensure it has the correct initial maintainers. This will probably > have to be driven by the maintainers of whichever project is most motivated > to make this happen. It sounds like that could be Mbed TLS and this will need > to be done before any separation of the PSA Crypto implementation. In the > short term, as we move C stdlib functionality out of the other projects and > into this new project, we will need to support multiple implementations of > some functions. Eventually we should move towards a common implementation, > and I agree we should look at what security-oriented implementations are > already available. > > I also agree it would make sense for Mbed TLS to not use the toolchain- > provided stdlib implementation by default, but only once it uses a default > implementation it trusts. > > Regards > > Dan. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf > Of > > Ronald Cron via mbed-tls > > Sent: 09 April 2020 08:47 > > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > > Subject: Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from > the code > > base > > > > Hi, I think this is related to the more general need for an > implementation of > > the C standard library for trusted firmware projects. As far as I know > TF-A > > and TF-M don't use the standard library provided by compilation > toolchains. > > The rationale is to have complete control over the trusted firmware > code. > > Currently they both have their own partial implementation of the parts > of the > > C standard library they need. > > > > This memory_buffer_alloc.c module in question here is another partial > > implementation of the C standard library. Currently TF-A and TF-M don't > > use/provide dynamic memory allocations but PSA-FF explicitly mentions > that an > > SPM implementation may support dynamic memory allocation. Thus it is > possible > > that TF-M at some point consider providing dynamic memory allocation > support. > > > > All of this to say that a possible way forward may be to remove > > memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base when there is a C standard > library > > implementation common to trustedfirmware.org projects (is there already > a > > security oriented open source implementation out there ?). > > > > In Mbed TLS, it would also make sense to me to, by default, not use C > > standard libraries provided by compilation toolchains > > (MBEDTLS_PLATFORM_NO_STD_FUNCTIONS defined by default). > > > > Thanks, Ronald. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf > Of > > Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard via mbed-tls > > Sent: 08 April 2020 12:42 > > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > > Cc: nd <nd(a)arm.com> > > Subject: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the > code > > base > > > > Hi all, > > > > In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: > > should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? > > > > [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ > > > > Currently the crypto library includes a module called > memory_buffer_alloc.c, > > disabled in the default build (config.h option > MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), > > which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a user- > > provided buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for > use in > > the rest of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the > > standard functions. > > > > In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module > also > > offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. > > > > We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code > base > > entirely for the following reasons: > > > > - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. > > > > - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. > For > > example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the > actual > > memory used. > > > > - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run > many > > tests with it enabled. > > > > - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed > TLS and > > X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should > fall. > > Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. > > > > On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: > > > > - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. > > > > - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security > > incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we > spend > > our maintenance resources. > > > > What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of > Mbed > > TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using > this > > allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? > > > > Regards, > > Manuel. > > -- > > mbed-tls mailing list > > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy > the > > information in any medium. Thank you. > > -- > > mbed-tls mailing list > > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the > information in any medium. Thank you. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls > > > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the > information in any medium. Thank you. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls

5 years, 2 months

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Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by Janos Follath

Hi, Based on what I read on this thread it seems an accepted point of view that the toolchain provided C standard library implementations are less trusted than the toolchains themselves. Can somebody please help me understand the reasoning behind this distinction? Regards, Janos On 09/04/2020, 12:07, "Dan Handley via mbed-tls" <mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> wrote: Hi There has already been some discussion about a shared C standard library implementation, at least for TF-A and TF-M. So far there's been general agreement that this is a good idea but no actual commitment from anyone to make this happen, since each project is reasonably happy with what they've got. Regarding MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C, TF-A at least enables this so removing this from the codebase would be an issue there. Memory allocators are probably not the core expertise of other Trusted Firmware projects either but it needs to be if they're going to use them! I propose that we move this allocator into a new shared TrustedFirmware.org standard C library project and work with the other projects to ensure it has the correct initial maintainers. This will probably have to be driven by the maintainers of whichever project is most motivated to make this happen. It sounds like that could be Mbed TLS and this will need to be done before any separation of the PSA Crypto implementation. In the short term, as we move C stdlib functionality out of the other projects and into this new project, we will need to support multiple implementations of some functions. Eventually we should move towards a common implementation, and I agree we should look at what security-oriented implementations are already available. I also agree it would make sense for Mbed TLS to not use the toolchain-provided stdlib implementation by default, but only once it uses a default implementation it trusts. Regards Dan. > -----Original Message----- > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of > Ronald Cron via mbed-tls > Sent: 09 April 2020 08:47 > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > Subject: Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code > base > > Hi, I think this is related to the more general need for an implementation of > the C standard library for trusted firmware projects. As far as I know TF-A > and TF-M don't use the standard library provided by compilation toolchains. > The rationale is to have complete control over the trusted firmware code. > Currently they both have their own partial implementation of the parts of the > C standard library they need. > > This memory_buffer_alloc.c module in question here is another partial > implementation of the C standard library. Currently TF-A and TF-M don't > use/provide dynamic memory allocations but PSA-FF explicitly mentions that an > SPM implementation may support dynamic memory allocation. Thus it is possible > that TF-M at some point consider providing dynamic memory allocation support. > > All of this to say that a possible way forward may be to remove > memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base when there is a C standard library > implementation common to trustedfirmware.org projects (is there already a > security oriented open source implementation out there ?). > > In Mbed TLS, it would also make sense to me to, by default, not use C > standard libraries provided by compilation toolchains > (MBEDTLS_PLATFORM_NO_STD_FUNCTIONS defined by default). > > Thanks, Ronald. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of > Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard via mbed-tls > Sent: 08 April 2020 12:42 > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > Cc: nd <nd(a)arm.com> > Subject: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code > base > > Hi all, > > In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: > should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? > > [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ > > Currently the crypto library includes a module called memory_buffer_alloc.c, > disabled in the default build (config.h option MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), > which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a user- > provided buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for use in > the rest of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the > standard functions. > > In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module also > offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. > > We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code base > entirely for the following reasons: > > - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. > > - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. For > example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the actual > memory used. > > - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run many > tests with it enabled. > > - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed TLS and > X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should fall. > Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. > > On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: > > - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. > > - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security > incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we spend > our maintenance resources. > > What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of Mbed > TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using this > allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? > > Regards, > Manuel. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the > information in any medium. Thank you. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you. -- mbed-tls mailing list mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you.

5 years, 2 months

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Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by Dan Handley

Hi There has already been some discussion about a shared C standard library implementation, at least for TF-A and TF-M. So far there's been general agreement that this is a good idea but no actual commitment from anyone to make this happen, since each project is reasonably happy with what they've got. Regarding MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C, TF-A at least enables this so removing this from the codebase would be an issue there. Memory allocators are probably not the core expertise of other Trusted Firmware projects either but it needs to be if they're going to use them! I propose that we move this allocator into a new shared TrustedFirmware.org standard C library project and work with the other projects to ensure it has the correct initial maintainers. This will probably have to be driven by the maintainers of whichever project is most motivated to make this happen. It sounds like that could be Mbed TLS and this will need to be done before any separation of the PSA Crypto implementation. In the short term, as we move C stdlib functionality out of the other projects and into this new project, we will need to support multiple implementations of some functions. Eventually we should move towards a common implementation, and I agree we should look at what security-oriented implementations are already available. I also agree it would make sense for Mbed TLS to not use the toolchain-provided stdlib implementation by default, but only once it uses a default implementation it trusts. Regards Dan. > -----Original Message----- > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of > Ronald Cron via mbed-tls > Sent: 09 April 2020 08:47 > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > Subject: Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code > base > > Hi, I think this is related to the more general need for an implementation of > the C standard library for trusted firmware projects. As far as I know TF-A > and TF-M don't use the standard library provided by compilation toolchains. > The rationale is to have complete control over the trusted firmware code. > Currently they both have their own partial implementation of the parts of the > C standard library they need. > > This memory_buffer_alloc.c module in question here is another partial > implementation of the C standard library. Currently TF-A and TF-M don't > use/provide dynamic memory allocations but PSA-FF explicitly mentions that an > SPM implementation may support dynamic memory allocation. Thus it is possible > that TF-M at some point consider providing dynamic memory allocation support. > > All of this to say that a possible way forward may be to remove > memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base when there is a C standard library > implementation common to trustedfirmware.org projects (is there already a > security oriented open source implementation out there ?). > > In Mbed TLS, it would also make sense to me to, by default, not use C > standard libraries provided by compilation toolchains > (MBEDTLS_PLATFORM_NO_STD_FUNCTIONS defined by default). > > Thanks, Ronald. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of > Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard via mbed-tls > Sent: 08 April 2020 12:42 > To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > Cc: nd <nd(a)arm.com> > Subject: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code > base > > Hi all, > > In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: > should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? > > [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ > > Currently the crypto library includes a module called memory_buffer_alloc.c, > disabled in the default build (config.h option MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), > which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a user- > provided buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for use in > the rest of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the > standard functions. > > In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module also > offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. > > We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code base > entirely for the following reasons: > > - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. > > - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. For > example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the actual > memory used. > > - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run many > tests with it enabled. > > - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed TLS and > X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should fall. > Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. > > On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: > > - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. > > - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security > incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we spend > our maintenance resources. > > What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of Mbed > TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using this > allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? > > Regards, > Manuel. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls > IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are > confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended > recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the > contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the > information in any medium. Thank you. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you.

5 years, 2 months

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Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by Ronald Cron

Hi, I think this is related to the more general need for an implementation of the C standard library for trusted firmware projects. As far as I know TF-A and TF-M don't use the standard library provided by compilation toolchains. The rationale is to have complete control over the trusted firmware code. Currently they both have their own partial implementation of the parts of the C standard library they need. This memory_buffer_alloc.c module in question here is another partial implementation of the C standard library. Currently TF-A and TF-M don't use/provide dynamic memory allocations but PSA-FF explicitly mentions that an SPM implementation may support dynamic memory allocation. Thus it is possible that TF-M at some point consider providing dynamic memory allocation support. All of this to say that a possible way forward may be to remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base when there is a C standard library implementation common to trustedfirmware.org projects (is there already a security oriented open source implementation out there ?). In Mbed TLS, it would also make sense to me to, by default, not use C standard libraries provided by compilation toolchains (MBEDTLS_PLATFORM_NO_STD_FUNCTIONS defined by default). Thanks, Ronald. -----Original Message----- From: mbed-tls <mbed-tls-bounces(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> On Behalf Of Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard via mbed-tls Sent: 08 April 2020 12:42 To: mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org Cc: nd <nd(a)arm.com> Subject: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base Hi all, In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ Currently the crypto library includes a module called memory_buffer_alloc.c, disabled in the default build (config.h option MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a user-provided buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for use in the rest of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the standard functions. In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module also offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code base entirely for the following reasons: - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. For example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the actual memory used. - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run many tests with it enabled. - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed TLS and X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should fall. Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we spend our maintenance resources. What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of Mbed TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using this allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? Regards, Manuel. -- mbed-tls mailing list mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you.

5 years, 2 months

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Re: [mbed-tls] 3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by ROSHINI DEVI

Hello All, In our embedded platform, we are using static memory allocator, instead of using heap memory of the platform. We thought it is better way to handle the memory. As the application grows, there might be multiple libraries using the heap memory. And also the possible cause of memory leaks. My suggestion is that it is better to have it. I have seen this kind of allocator in mocona secure library also. Thanks On Wed, Apr 8, 2020 at 4:11 PM Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard via mbed-tls < mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org> wrote: > Hi all, > > In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: > should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? > > [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ > > Currently the crypto library includes a module called > memory_buffer_alloc.c, > disabled in the default build (config.h option > MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), > which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a > user-provided > buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for use in the > rest > of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the standard > functions. > > In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module also > offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. > > We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code base > entirely for the following reasons: > > - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. > > - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. For > example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the actual > memory used. > > - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run many > tests with it enabled. > > - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed TLS > and > X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should > fall. > Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. > > On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: > > - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. > > - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security > incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we > spend > our maintenance resources. > > What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of > Mbed > TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using this > allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? > > Regards, > Manuel. > -- > mbed-tls mailing list > mbed-tls(a)lists.trustedfirmware.org > https://lists.trustedfirmware.org/mailman/listinfo/mbed-tls >

5 years, 2 months

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3.0 plans: remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base

by Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard

Hi all, In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: should we remove memory_buffer_alloc.c from the code base? [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ Currently the crypto library includes a module called memory_buffer_alloc.c, disabled in the default build (config.h option MBEDTLS_MEMORY_BUFFER_ALLOC_C), which provides implementations of calloc() and free() based on a user-provided buffer (which could be static or on the stack), suitable for use in the rest of the crypto, X.509 and TLS libraries as replacements to the standard functions. In addition to providing replacement calloc() and free(), the module also offers some facilities for measurement and debugging. We're considering dropping this module and removing it from the code base entirely for the following reasons: - Memory allocators are not our core area of expertise. - This allocator is pretty basic and has a large allocation overhead. For example for ECC computations, the overhead can be as large as the actual memory used. - Using this allocator also tends to slow things down, so we don't run many tests with it enabled. - In the future when we split between PSA Crypto on one side and Mbed TLS and X.509 on the other, it's unclear on which side this allocator should fall. Which can be taken as a sign that it doesn't really belong here. On the other hand, we're hesitating for the following reasons: - We know from bug reports and questions that some people are using it. - Unlike other modules we'd like to drop, there isn't a strong security incentive to dropping this allocator, it's merely a matter of how we spend our maintenance resources. What do you think? Should we keep maintaining this allocator as part of Mbed TLS? Should we drop it and focus on our core instead? If you're using this allocator, why did you pick it over other alternatives? Regards, Manuel.

5 years, 2 months

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3.0 plans: remove havege.c from the code base

by Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard

Hi all, In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: should we remove havege.c from the code base? [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ The crypto library currently includes an implementation of the HAVEGE entropy gatherer [2], which is disabled in the default build (MBEDTLS_HAVEGE_C in config.h), but used as a source by our entropy module if enabled. [2]: https://www.irisa.fr/caps/projects/hipsor/ We'd like to drop this module and remove it from the code base entirely for the following reasons: - HAVEGE was designed for superscalar processors with high microarchitectural complexity, and is unsuitable for microcontrollers (or virtualized environments). We feel like when a complex enough CPU is used for HAVEGE to stand a chance of being secure, it's very likely that an operating system is also available, which probably already manages a random generator better that what we can do in user space. - On a more practical note, our implementation relies on `timing_hardclock()` provided by timing.c only for a limited number of architectures and environments (funnily enough, not including any Arm architecture), with a silent fallback to a definition relying on `gettimeofday()` which is clearly not high-resolution enough to make HAVEGE secure. - As with any random source, it is very difficult to assess whether HAVEGE is actually secure on any given platform. Further, the maintenance team doesn't have any specific knowledge of HAVEGE and there hasn't been any independent evaluation of our implementation of it. - As a result of the above points, we're afraid people using our HAVEGE implementation on the wrong platforms, might be getting a false sense of security, which might prevent them from using more secure options, such as the OS RNG (when using an OS) or a hardware RNG (on microcontrollers). If you're using MBEDTLS_HAVEGE_C or know someone who does, or if for any other reason you think we shouldn't drop it in Mbed TLS 3.0, please speak up now! Regards, Manuel.

5 years, 2 months

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3.0 plans: remove pkcs11.c from the code base

by Manuel Pegourie-Gonnard

Hi all, In this new installment of "let's discuss ideas for Mbed TLS 3.0" [1]: should we remove pkcs11.c from the code base? [1]: https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/tech-plans-3.0/ The X.509 library currently includes a module called "pkcs11", excluded from the default build, which provides a few wrappers around libpkcs11-helper [2], a library that "simplifies the interaction with PKCS#11 providers for end-user applications". In practice, it supports the use of X.509 certificates associated with an RSA key (not ECDSA) managed by libpkcs11-helper. [2]: https://github.com/OpenSC/pkcs11-helper We'd like to drop this module and remove it from the code base entirely for the following reasons: - It has limited functionality, and soon PSA Crypto will provide more flexible support for secure management of private keys (not just RSA, and not just associated with X.509 certificates). - It currently has not automated tests so we're not even sure if it still works properly. - The documentation is scarce and no member of the current maintenance team knows for sure how it's supposed to work. - We never receive any support request about it so we're not sure if anyone is still using it. (As a weaker signal in the same direction, we deprecated it in 2.21.0, released 2020-02-20, and nobody complained so far.) If you're using MBEDTLS_PKCS11_C or know someone who does, or if for any other reason you think we shouldn't drop it in Mbed TLS 3.0, please speak up now! Regards, Manuel. IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium. Thank you.

5 years, 2 months

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Mbed TLS/PSA Crypto Roadmap

by Shebu Varghese Kuriakose

Hi All, Here is the link to the roadmap for Mbed TLS and PSA Crypto in the coming quarters. https://developer.trustedfirmware.org/w/mbed-tls/roadmap/ If you are interested in collaborating on any of the roadmap features or other features in the project, please let your interest known via. the mailing lists. Note that the expected quarter when a feature will be completed is based on very rough estimates of the effort involved and therefore might change. Roadmap will be reviewed and updated at the start of every quarter depending on progress made in previous quarter. Thanks, Shebu (Mbed TLS, PSA Crypto Technology Manager, Arm)

5 years, 2 months

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